Thursday, April 19, 2007

Arming Students?

Let's be clear. I support the 2nd Amendment. Honest CITIZENS (not foreign nationals) should have the right to bear arms. But suggesting that students carry arms so that future tragedies such as this might be prevented borders on ridiculous.

Future tragedies? Despite the coverage campus violence gets in this country, this is not a common occurrence. I believe the saturation coverage probably does more to influence copycats than any other factor.

By far, most high school and college campuses are safe places but when events such as this occur, there will be those who call for extreme measures. Armed students are far more likely to kill themselves accidentally then they are at stopping a rampaging student.

Gun-rights advocates call for arming students

NEW YORK — A gun-rights advocate said Tuesday that if Virginia Tech students and employees had been armed they would have been able to defend themselves in the rampage.

"The only person who is responsible to defend you is you - the police are incapable of defending each and every one of us all the time," said Mike Stollenwerk, 44, co-founder of Open, a Virginia-based gun-rights networking group.

In Virginia, anyone 21 years of age or older holding a concealed handgun permit can carry a weapon. But Virginia Tech and other colleges across the state have policies that prohibit bringing weapons onto campus.

"If there were no restrictions, then somebody might have been able to stop him," said Bradford Wiles, a Virginia Tech graduate student, referring to Cho Seung-Hui, the 23-year-old student responsible for the rampage.

This rates as one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard. Let's keep our schools free of guns. Education, not 9 mm handguns, is the answer.


At 9:27 AM, Blogger Gayle said...

I do agree that the idea of giving students handguns is ridiculous. I don't believe that the gun-rights activist is the brightest bulb on the tree. I wouldn't send my child to a college where everyone was packing! But I'm not certain about vetoing the idea of professors having a gun - put away in a safe place of course - for emergencies such as this. It may have saved lives.

The professors would of course have to be trained in the handling and use of firearms. The downside is that even professors have been known to go off the deep end. I'm uncertain about this, for sure!

I won't pretend to know what the answer is. With a daughter currently attending college I have a personal interest in this subject. I do know something must be done. Our children can not be sitting in classrooms where any nutjob can walk off the street, or another student who is crazier than rat crap can kill them.

It's certain that colleges are going to have to spend more money on security systems, cameras and such. Also, these campuses that consist of several buildings that are wide open are a problem. I'm happy to say that the college my daughter attends consists of one building with many security cameras, but I'm still concerned.

Most of all I'm concerned about copycat killings. I pray for the safety of my daughter daily, and I'm sure I'm not alone in that.

At 10:24 AM, Blogger Urban Infidel said...

I think I'm finally over my fear of guns. My sister killed herself with one.
I'm going to start taking shooting lessons at the gun range in Manhattan.

At 10:57 AM, Blogger WomanHonorThyself said...

I agree with Gayle...who knows what the entire solution is but one thing we do know...we have a right to bear arms!

At 4:07 PM, Blogger Obob said...

Arming students maybe make the newsrounds, but is very dumb. I remember in college, between our apartment and the other necks across the hall, we had:
3 pistols
three shotguns
a rifle
a muzzle loader
an assualt rifle
unknown BB guns
and enough firewoks to level Newark.
None of these were mine. None of us had any business with these weapons and our drinking habits.

At 4:19 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

I remember we had enough bottle rockets in our dorm to do justice to any Chinese new year, which we shot off periodically, usually depending on our state of inebriation.
There might have been a couple of BB guns but that's all I knew about.
I think Gayle has a good point with arming professors but the vast majority of professors I knew were vehemently pro gun-control and wouldn't know which end of the gun to point. Most likely, they would have ended up getting themselves killed without helping in any way.
I personally don't think having guns on school grounds is a policy I would endorse.

At 5:04 PM, Blogger Jungle Mom said...

I don't think we need to arm the students, but, I do feel they are not children. Young adults of the same age are in Iraq carrying loaded, powerful weapons as we speak. I think the campus police certainly should be armed!

At 6:47 PM, Blogger Life Hiker said...

Amen to that, Caped Crusader!

I've had a few teachers that were so boring that I'm lucky I didn't have a 9mm on me or I'd be in jail.

On the other hand, I know that there is really very little serious violence in everyday life for almost everyone,especially students. What violence there is seems to be concentrated in places where there are a lot of dissatisfied, angry, territorial people - or in disfunctional families.

I get around a lot, and I used to travel a lot. In the past 40 years I haven't had a single experience where I thought a gun might come in handy. What a waste if I'd been carrying one all that time! Probably would have shot myself even though I was once asked to run the 101st Airborne pistol team.

Nevertheless, if sane and trained adult citizens want to get a license and pack an extra pound or two around with them,I'm OK with that. Just don't point the damn thing at me by mistake.

At 8:03 PM, Blogger Obob said...

I would have no problem with the profs being armed, as long as they qualified. And if some students do come armed, the thought of expulsion should be tossed out. This may sound like I am trying to ride the fence, but I have always said guns are like motorcycles, some should have them some should not. I have neither.
Something to think about: Liberals scream we take away student's civil rights at the university level. Mean while, the Left constricts conservative views and would crap with a practicing 2nd amendment

At 5:57 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ban the Political Correct ideology, and allow GOD back into schools!


At 6:24 AM, Blogger Urban Infidel said...

I think we should bring back the Pledge of Allegiance.

At 8:56 AM, Blogger American Crusader said...

When I taught school in Miami in the late 80's and early 90's, my first period class ALWAYS recited the Pledge of Allegiance including "one Nation UNDER GOD, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all".

At 10:51 AM, Blogger Brooke said...

All the education in the world wouldn't have stopped FREAK CHO, so I don't think that is the end-all answer...

My question is this: If a facility such as a school, store, whatever, that posts a "no guns permitted" sign outside fails to protect me from injury/death by someone like Cho, are they then responsible? After all, they took away my ability to protect myself.

Just asking.

At 12:07 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

Brooke..I never said it was the "end all" solution but if you want to send your kids to schools and grocery stores that arm their students and employees..feel free to do so.
I'd like to know which grocery store you go to that would have prevented Cho from going on a rampage?
My experiences at a large college tell me that having every student equipped with a 45 cal. handgun probably isn't a good idea.
Don't be surprised if some of the guys start comparing their guns to see who shoots the largest ammunition.
Cho sent more than enough warning signals that were overlooked or ignored by psychiatrists, professors, police and fellow students.
I'm also willing to bet that Cho isn't alone in this situation.

At 12:11 PM, Blogger American Crusader said...

"My question is this: If a facility such as a school, store, whatever, that posts a "no guns permitted" sign outside fails to protect me from injury/death by someone like Cho, are they then responsible? After all, they took away my ability to protect myself."

As opposed to what? Being in the middle of the OK Corral? What happens when an inexperienced shooter "accidentally" shoots you? Are you going to sue him for trying to protect you?

Just saying..

At 4:46 PM, Blogger Brooke said...

I wouldn't sue someone who accidentally shot me, just as I would not sue the cops.

I used to work third shifts in a hospital ER. At night, the medium-sized hospital kept one unarmed guard on the entire campus who would NEVER be in the most violent department, where we always had drunks, druggies, ect.

The hospital, of course, did not want people to carry concealed weapons on their property, but my beef is this:The hospital did not even TRY to provide safety not only to the employees, but to the other patients in the facility, and most public places do not.

Shouldn't there be a reasonable expectation of security, gun toting madmen aside? If these places want to neuter the law abiding citizen of the ability to protect himself, shouldn't they be held accountable?

(An aside:The grocery store I go to actually keeps a police officer in the store at all times to deter theft and provide security. They pay for him! :D)

At 10:41 AM, Blogger Ducky's here said...

First remember that mass shootings such as Cho's on a college campus are very rare. Shooting normally involve people known to each other.

So let's assume that there are three people in Cho's class who regularly carry. He knows who they are and kills them forst. Then you have a bunch of people running around armed, not trained to handle these situations and very nervous...I doubt they are going to mitigate the damage much and might even cause more.

That's not even considering the amount of alcohol on campus, testosterone poisoned frat boys bringing them to sporting events .. etc.

The case that allowing carry would take more lives than would be saved is not much of a stratch.


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